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Investing in comics!
As we wind down my Tales Of The Marvel Age, this is my favourite because it is so silly and totally unbelievable. But you have to believe me, this is true. Really! It happened around the year 2000.
Having newly boarded and bagged 5,000 copies and getting my first Overstreet guide, I was astonished at the potential value of my comics. And with so many comic stores open it seemed that old comics were big business. Unfortunately, I told that to my then current girlfriend (Betty) who had always thought comics were worthless.
We were going out for dinner with her friends, who I'll call "Lois and Clark". We often had dinner with them, a nice couple. We'd arranged for them to call at my place first, and when I opened the door, there they were with their 12-year son who was holding about five or six new comics. They were all #1s. They were titles I didn't know and by companies I hadn't heard of.
Lois and Clark said they'd stopped by the local comic book store and bought comics the dealer said would be worth a lot of money in the next few years.
Me: Be careful. Dealers just want you to buy comics, and very few that come out in the year 2000 will be worth anything in the future. That's because no one throws out comics anymore!
Lois and Clark: We know, that's why we brought our son with us. We'll need college money in six years and we want to buy the right comics to pay his tuition. Betty says you know which are the right ones to buy.
Me: Actually, I don't. I don't buy current comics and I doubt that anything bought today will be worth something in six years.
Lois and Clark: Betty says you have valuable comics, and that you know which ones to buy.
Me: Not really. It was all luck. When I bought comics they were disposable, people often threw them out after reading. Had I known they were going to be worth money one day I would've kept my first Justice Leagues and Lois Lanes! (At this point I thought the subject was over. I was wrong.)
Lois and Clark: You have valuable comics. Betty says they're worth a lot of money. Which ones should we buy? We need money for college.
Me: I really can't help you other than to say you should save your money and invest it. Do you want to buy old comics and see if their price goes up?
Lois and Clark: We want to invest in new comics, ones we can get for just a few dollars. Just tell us which ones.
Me: I don't know. I don't collect new comics and I certainly can't tell you if they'll ever be worth anything, but it's doubtful that prices will skyrocket in six years.
Lois and Clark: Of course you know, you bought the right ones for yourself. We'd then buy not just one but a few of them. And Betty says that you said their prices really went up in the last few years.
Me: That was an accident, I didn't know. If I had, I'd have bought ten copies of each. (Especially Amazing Fantasy #15!)
Lois and Clark: So you won't tell us?
Me (turning to the kid): The best thing you can do is buy the comics you like and put them in your closet for thirty years.
The kid: I don't like comics.
Me: Then don't buy them. Buy the things you like. Why'd you buy the ones you have?
The kid: The dealer said they'd be worth a lot of money one day.
Me: Will you read them?
The kid: No.
Lois and Clark: So you won't help us?! That's selfish to keep it all to yourself.
Believe or not, this went on all night. I was never to see Lois and Clark again, as they refused to come to my house or invite me to theirs. They did stay friends with Betty, certainly longer than I did, and the three of them always thought I had a secret that I wouldn't share. People, eh?
With friends like that, who need friends? (Think about it - it says exactly what I mean.)
ReplyDeleteYeah but Barry seriously what comics should they buy lol. I agree Kid they were pretty crappy "friends " . By keeping asking the same question when you clearly told them you don't know that to me shows what they were really like barely fairweather acquaintances.
ReplyDeleteLove the Hi and Lois strip at the start of your story .
Isn't it amazing that they were seemingly unable to understand why comics that were 25 to nearly 40 years old which had made a significant historical impact and thereby increased in value, were always going to be worth more than what new comics would be worth in six years. "Your FF #1 from 1961 is worth 1000s of dollars, so which bland comic from 2000 is going to be worth that in 2006?" Thickos.
ReplyDeleteWherever there's something that people enjoy and love, other people will try to muscle in and ruin it. The whole speculator boom in the 90s had a massive impact on the industry, meaning that Marvel especially were on a constant quest to put out collectable comics that valued sensation over substance and led to me (and others, I'm sure) stepping away from comics for a few years.
ReplyDeleteI must admit I did buy doubles of a few comics in the 90s with an eye on their future value, but only if they had different covers- I never bought two exactly the same, and I always read them, didn't just bag them and file them away.
I think Barry's story just shows that some people are unable to appreciate fun or beauty without seeing dollar signs flashing in front of their eyes.
It's always the way, isn't it, DS? And such people don't comprehend that a comic has to be in pristine condition to achieve its optimum value. Lois, Clark and their kid would probably have dirty fingermarks all over their comics, with creases on the covers and spines, and then wonder, in the unlikely event that a particular ish ever eventually came to be worth, say, $50, why they were being offered only $5 for it by a dealer. "Because you never looked after it, you cretins!" (Well, for that reason and also because the dealer is a crook.)
ReplyDeleteYup, all some people care about is money. Now excuse me - I must go and count my gold.
I bought two issues of Howard the Duck and Epic magazine! If I had bought that ridiculous mutant ninja turtle comic I would have made money. Goes to show doesn’t it?
ReplyDeleteI suppose that it's hard to predict just what comics will eventually turn into expensive collectors' items, PS, but comics should really be bought to be enjoyed, not just as an 'investment'. Having said that, I've bought several copies of some mags myself, though with only half an eye on investment potential, and mainly because I liked them and wanted some spares - just in case my main copy got damaged.
ReplyDeleteThere was a rush to invest in comics in the 1990s, I understand that. And I lot of people thought they could get in at the beginning, bug they were really coming in at the middle. I wonder what the salesman said to get them to buy so many comics. I also wondered who they thought they would be selling it to.
ReplyDeleteWhat got to me was their persistence, they would not accept from me that new comics would probably not have much value. They believed the guy in the comics store that sold them the comics they never heard of. And how “rare” and in demand would a comic be in six years?
It was a very boring and trying night because they brought their son along and that made this the main topic for the evening. They had not done that before.
My former girlfriend also could not understand why I did not sell the comics, even after I explained that if I as in it for the money, I would have sold it long ago. There is a bit of a contradiction here, she thought comics were worthless and therefore easy to part with.
She clearly didn't understand you, BP, and was only looking for someone to spend money on her. That seems to have been her main interest (apart from herself) - money. If you've got something that's worth money, then why not sell it and get the money? People like that just don't understand that life is more than just about money (though it helps). In my humble opinion (and remember - I'm famous for my humility) you were well-shot of her.
ReplyDeleteDone a little research after reading Barry's post earlier and realised that at the very height of the speculator boom, I was fanatically buying Quasar and the Spectre.
ReplyDeleteI'd imagine no issue of either of those is worth any more than £1 these days, but the enjoyment I got from those was worth more to me than their resale value. Lois and Clark's son sadly missed out on that feeling!
That's the whole thing about comics, isn't it, DS - the enjoyment factor. I think I bought the first few issues of Quasar, but I can't remember anything about the series now. (Doesn't mean I didn't enjoy them though.) Wonder what Lois and Clark's son's name was - Luthor?
ReplyDeletePeople who are not into comics probably read an article or a price guide and see where Action Comics #1 or Human Torch #2 sold for some sky-high price, and assume that they can make a killing by getting in on the ground floor buying the earliest issues of the latest comics.
ReplyDeleteThey don't understand that the market has completely changed. Comics from the 1960s and earlier are rare; a lot of kids bought them, read them once, and threw them away. So the supply now is lower than the demand. (And they can be reprinted, but the supply of the original copies themselves cannot be increased.)
Since the 1980s, though, the market has been collectors and speculators. Which means a catch-22: it is hard to find someone who wants a given item and who does not already have it.
Selling to dealers is also problematic. Most dealers already have all of the recent (1980s and later) comics they can use. And even if you find one who wants your collection, selling to a dealer means you get low balled. Not necessarily because the dealer is a crook, but that's just how it works. Dealers buy stuff intending to resell it at a profit. There is no point in buying something and then selling it for the same price. So, even if your copy of Brother Power the Geek #1 is worth $1000 according to the Overprice Street Guide, a dealer will not offer you more than half of that.
Those comics that "Clark and Lois" bought probably ended up being sold for pennies on the dollar, and are now sitting in some shop's four-for-a-dollar bin.
About the same time as Barry's encounter was when DC killed off Superman. I remember telling a mother who's 8 year old read comics that it wasn't really going to be the end of Superman comics and the 'last' issue would not therefore be a valuable collectible.
ReplyDeleteI did save the Animated Batman comics that were my daughters. They were both well illustrated and written. Hopefully her son will one day enjoy them. The same goes for the Disney reprints from the early 90's that had Carl Barks stories I remembered from the 50's.
The moral is buy comics because you enjoy them. If they appreciate in value that's better than tossing them out for recycling.
Thing about dealers though, TC, is that they want too big a percentage of a comic's value. If a comic is worth, say, £1000, to expect to make 50% of that is pure greed. £200-£250 should be more than enough for them (even less than that, some would say - especially on consignment). And even the more honest ones who admit what a comic is worth to the seller, still want to offer as little as they can get away with. There's making a living and making a killing, and too many dealers go for the latter option.
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I remember a guy around the corner from me, who wasn't into comics, buying the issue where Clark married Lois (not BP's acquaintances) because of all the attention it got in the media at the time, thinking it would be worth a fortune one day. He's probably still waiting for that fortune - and will be for some time (like forever), T47.
I wonder how "Lois & Clark" paid for their son's college education in the end? Not with the comics they'd bought obviously :D
ReplyDeleteNever in my life have I bought a comic with its' future worth in mind!
Yeah, but that's only because you're a multi-millionaire, CJ. (Takes one to know one.)
ReplyDeleteThe number of comic and non-comic book fans that though buying the death of Superman issue (a terrible issue of an excellent run) was going to be worth thousands of pounds/dollars is mind-blowing, ditto the last Dandy etc. Now the early and brilliant Batman Adventures, especially those with Bruce Timm art and Harley Quinn appearing are worth a few pounds (not lots but well above average). I have never paid much attention to the value of newer comics (from the early 80s onwards) sadly that has resulted in giving away the first issues of TMNT to a charity shop ina batch of other books, losing issue 1 of Spawn and putting the first issue of Viz comic in the bin as I thought it was rubbish (along with my free "ice cream cone" and covering letter):(
ReplyDeleteI occasionally bought two issues of certain comics, McS, but for two reasons. If it was one I liked the look of, I bought a spare in case I ever damaged my main copy. If in years to come, my main copy remained undamaged but the issue was worth something, I figured I could sell my spare if I ever needed the money. Having said that, I ended up giving some of those spare copies to friends - no charge. Never been a fan of Viz for some reason. Once you get past the 'buzz' (if you even get it to start with) of seeing what looks like a traditional comic with sweary words, then its moment is over.
ReplyDeleteBlogger Colin Jones said...
ReplyDeleteI wonder how "Lois & Clark" paid for their son's college education in the end?
Well since the boy didn't enjoy comics a higher education than grade school would be beyond his needs.
Very true, T47. The closest he probably got to 'higher education' was working as a janitor in a college.
ReplyDeleteWe who like comics have always collected them because we enjoy them, we don’t see them as investments. But many dealers did. And they tried to persuade their customers to buy them as investments. I bet many succeeded.
ReplyDeleteTC and Terranova47: I think you are right, they say some article or something. In the US we have the Home Shopping network where they show items on TV and you can buy them. When they had the Death of Superman in comics HSN was selling four of the series for $75. They told viewers that this was a special comic, perhaps the last of Superman, and that prices in comics go up, they don’t go down. I am sure they convinced a lot of people, who didn’t read comics, that these were a good investment.
Lois and Clark’s comics are probably not in “some shop's four-for-a-dollar bin” because all those stores have closed. They were in some garbage bin.
People don’t understand that the comics that are worth the most money are rare. Perhaps because they are so old or because not many were run. They are also old. To think that current comics are not being kept and that one day they will not only be in demand but hard to find is ridiculous
You know, I have a sympathy for the boy. The sins of his parents should not be brought upon him. He was being taught that there was an easy way out and there is none. Also, I was made a villain for no reason, and I was someone to blame. His parents needed to save for his college, not blame me or any of the other people they probably imposed on.
Most important: I honestly collected what I liked and they have given me a great deal of pleasure. I never expected any financial gain, and when I went to buy better bags and boards I saw an expense. There will always be collectors and dealers who are in for the money. They just won’t be me. Or my friends.
And so say all of us, BP. (Pssst! Wanna buy my collection of Millie The Model? Only $40,000. Going cheap seeing as it's you.)
ReplyDeleteI am not paying more than $39,900!
ReplyDeleteIt's a deal. I'll take a cheque. Buyer collects.
ReplyDeleteI re-read the classic Carl Barks tale 'Tralla La' today, and it reminded me of Barry's anecdote with the scary couple. Good on you Barry on keeping your collection and enjoying it. I must admit that I have been tempted to sell off my collection and just rely on reprints, and I'm afraid that I have submitted on a few occasions to sell the odd comic, which I now bitterly regret.
ReplyDeleteSpirit of '64
Nothing beats the originals, S64, but the single issue Marvel and DC reprints are getting better all the time. There may come a time when I might consider selling my originals, but it wouldn't be for the pittance that too many dealers would likely offer for them.
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